Church House Photograph

(From Tom Greeves) The photograph on page 52 (Author's Note: Figure 7-10) is the same as that on page 71 of Dartmoor's Earliest Photographs - Landscape & Place 1860-1880 (see bibliography below). The archive may be interested to know that it was taken by Francis Bedford who was one of the finest photographers of the British landscape in the mid-Victorian period. It dates to about 1865-1870.

Mr Sanders

(From Tom Greeves) I suspect that Mr Sanders whose debt was repaid was Mr Joseph Sanders of Exeter and Brimpts - he restarted the tin mine there at the end of the 18th century - see my book Gentlemen & Rogues - A History of Brimpts Tin Mine, Dartmeet, Devon pp15-16 (see Bibliography below). He was certainly a man of means.(Author's Note: see page 44 and Figure 7-3. This is very interesting additional information. We still do not know what the original loan was for. However, if Mr Sanders was connected with Brimpts, which was in the Forest Quarter, then could it be related to the 'return' of the eastern Forest quarter to Lydford that occurred at around the same time?)

Composition Money

(From Tom Greeves) Re 'composition money' - might that not be for the composing of the account?

Maid of all Work

Pat Watson has pointed out an entry in the Buckland-in-the-Moor census for 1851: Elizabeth Waldron (?hard to read), aged fifteen, is 'Maid of all work' in the household of Stone Farm, where James Norrish is the farmer and Nancy Stockman Norrish is his wife along with nine children aged variously between one and sixteen.

Bringing Apprenticeships to Life

Liz Shakespeare has written a book, The Song of the Skylark, about a brother and sister who are apprenticed in North Devon in the 1840s. It is based on local research and provides a fascinating insight into what lies behind the bare facts presented in the official documents such as those in the 'Welfare in Widecombe' book. I heartily recommend this book to anyone who is interested in the social history of the time and/or local Devon history. It is a well-written story, occasionally heart-wrenching but also with hope for a better future. You can get a copy by following this link: www.lizshakespeare.co.uk/the-song-of-the-skylark

Comparative Studies

I keep hoping that one or two parishes will come up with their own history of welfare in their parish. It would be interesting to see in which ways the experience of other parishes matches that of Widecombe and in which ways they differ.

One source of comparative information is provided by Susannah Wheeleker and Sarah Eyles who produced a booklet (published by The Devonshire Association) of two studies of Poor Relief in Devon back in 1991 that resulted from their A-Level studies. The study of Abbotskerswell is especially relevant.

Census Returns

Dr Roger Ottewill, who has reviewed Welfare in Widecombe for The Local Historian (July 2021) has pointed out that census returns in the UK started in 1801, not 1841 as is stated in the book. Returns prior to 1841 were aggregated so that details of individual people were not published. So 1841 is the first census that provides us with details of individuals and where they lived etc.

Genuki has an interesting article on these early censuses as they relate to Devon with the full datasets for each parish accessible towards the end. This article can be viewed here. The datasets show that Widecombe had a population of 1043 in 1801, 1151 in 1811 and 934 in 1821. Quite a large population reflecting the predominantly labour-intensive farming activities of the community (745 people were engaged in agriculture in 1801).

Iris Woods on the Widecombe Parish Apprentices

In 'The Devon & Cornwall Notes & Queries Vol XXXV Part IV' (Autumn 1983), a journal of the Devon and Cornwall Record Society, Iris Woods writes about the apprenticeship records she finds in the Widecombe Parish Chest.

These are the same apprenticeship records that have now been digitised and are available to view online in the Widecombe Archive on this site.

Mrs Woods mentions Katherine Courters (or Courter) whose apprenticeship indenture is reproduced in the Welfare in Widecombe book (on page 91 - the archive catalogue reference is A052.047). Mrs Woods has done some more research into Katherine and suggests that the Catherine Curtis, who married Richard Stook in 1762, was likely to be the same person, although we cannot be completely certain of this.

Mrs Woods adds a postscript about Samuel Chapple, who lost his sight through smallpox. The townspeople of Crediton agreed that Samuel should be trained as an organist, given that he had shown some aptitude for music. He was apprenticed to a blind organist in Exeter and was thereafter appointed organist of Ashburton Parish Church, where he stayed until his death in 1833. He was a well-known figure in the district and he composed pieces for piano which had a wide popularity.

What a lovely story!

You can read a bit more about Samuel here.

Source: Woods, Iris, 'Parish Apprentices in Widecombe-in-the-Moor in the 18th and 19th centuries' in The Devon & Cornwall Notes & Queries Vol XXXV Part IV (Autumn 1983), pages 143 - 150.

Iris Woods on Memoranda in the Parish Officers' Accounts

In 'The Devon Historian Vol 14' (Spring 1977), the journal of the Devon History Society, Iris Woods writes about memoranda that she has found in the Parish Officers' Accounts, i.e. in the Churchwardens' and Overseers' Accounts.

She notes that there are no minutes of decisions taken, or at least no surviving record, as has been noted in the Welfare in Widecombe book. However, some of the decisions taken were noted in the account books in the form of memoranda and Mrs Woods draws our attention to a few of these.

Some of the items mentioned are also mentioned in the Welfare book (such as the penalty and retribution for the accidental killing of a hare).

The article can be viewed in full by going to the Devon Historian Journal Archive and choosing Volume 14. Mrs Woods' article starts on page 17.

By way of an aside, Freda Wilkinson has written an interesting article on 'The Dartmoor Husbandmen' starting on page 5 of the same publication.

Source: Devon Historian Journal Archive

SOME ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ABOUT HANNAH CRIBBETT PROVIDED BY DAVID ASHMAN

Hannah Cribbett (b 1794. d 1884)

Married: Issac Aptor Cribbet[t] at Widecombe in July 1814. Issac died in 1838.

Son William born October 1814 [??]

Cannot find entry for her on 1841 Census.

1851 Census: Living at Ponswothy, aged 58 listed as “Pauper and Wool Carder”. Also living with her son William (Aged 17) Ag Lab.

1861 Census: Living at Sweaton [?] Listed as AG Labs Widow (70) also living with her Ann Cribbett daughter (Almswoman? And invalid) Ann died later in 1861.

1871 Census living at 3 Ponsworthy, Widow aged (76) also living with her Johnny Cribbett (Grand-son aged 17) .

1881 Census. Unable to find any entry for Hannah Cribbett or any of her 7 children??.

Hannah died in 1884 aged 90/91 probably at the Newton Abbot Union and was brought to Leusdon to be buried.

Those living in Newton Abbot Union building according to 1881 Census:

Ann Mear, (Unmarried).(50) listed as Pauper.. Domestic Servant.

No records of this lady having been born or having lived in Widecombe.

Joanna Hannaford. (40) listed as pauper, listed as “Idiot from Childhood.”

In 1871 census listed as living with parents John Hannaford (74) and wife Betsy (69) at Poundsgate. Joanna had brother Samuel also listed in 1871 as “imbecile”.

Joanna remained at Woolborough and is named on the Workhouse census return for 1891. Samuel does not feature in the 1881 census.

The third name to appear is

Richard Caunter listed as a pauper, Married, (66), described as an Agricultural Labourer. Richard had married his second wife Elizabeth in 1871 two years after his first wife Martha had died. Richard was to father 3 children with Elizabeth all of whom were housed in the workhouse in 1881 Mary Ann (8), Mildred (6) and Richard Henry (4). Richard died in 1881 about the time of the census but his name remains in the records.

Elizabeth managed to get herself and the children out of the workhouse and in 1891 she is listed as a “charwoman” working and living in Torquay. She had to return to the workhouse in her latter years and is listed as living in Newton Abbot Union in 1911. Elizabeth died in 1913.

1891 Census

Joanna Hannaford ,now aged 56, remained at the workhouse is listed on the 1891 census as living there. She died at the workhouse in 1892.

A second person was named as an “inmate” on the 1891 census Elizabeth Jane Stevens aged 20 but it has not been possible to identify this person as a former Widecombe resident.

Checking for Widecombe Inmates:

The 1911 Census for the Newton Abbot Union Workhouse listed 424 “inmates” plus a resident staff of 20. The inmates were made up of 254 males, and 190 females. Of these there were only 26 children under the age 0f 17 (17 boys and 9 girls). The census lists 74 persons considered “imbeciles and weak minded” (43 females and 31 males). The vast majority of the “inmates” were at least 60 years of age and came from all parts of the United Kingdom and a few from Europe. The census did not identify anyone who had previously resided in Widecombe.

DA July 2019. Sources: ancestry.co.uk    ukcensusonline.com

Those listed “Lt” in the Overseers Accounts.

SILVESTER MANN: born 1745 WITM, died 31st July 1792 at WITM

JOHN TOWNSEND: born 1729 WITM, died 25th Feb 1806.

SIR FREDERICK ROGERS: former MP for Plymouth (1780-1797) died June 1797

JOHN STOCKMAN; born WITM 16th May 1736, died WITM 25th August 1783.

SIR FRANCIS BULLER; (justice Buller) lived at Prince Hall. Died 1800 (William Crossing One Hundred Years on Dartmoor Page 50)

THOMAS LEAMAN; born in WITM 1736 died Bickington 1793. Confirmed by Pastscapes records that he farmed 4 tenements and his brother John 1 tenement in 1786.

JOHN CLEAVE: born 22 August 1736 in WITM. Died 14th April 1783 at WITM.

ROBERT CLEAVE;born 24th August 1729 in WITM, died 27th February 1798 at WITM.

We have therefore, not unreasonably, concluded that "Lt" means "Late" and that their presence in the accounts is because their estates are still being dealt with and so liabilities and obligations remain the same during this period.

DA July 2019. Sources: ancestry.co.uk    ukcensusonline.com    pastscape.org.uk

Notes on Local Apprenticeships in the 1841 Census

David Ashman:

There were at least 34 apprenticeships registered in Widecombe in the 1841 Census.

24 boys and 10 Girls: 16 x 15 years old, 3 x 13 years old, 5 x 12 years old, 1 x 11 years old, 4 x 10vyears old, and 5 where age not provided.

The apprenticeships were spread over 20 farms.

Of equal interest there were a further 24 "children", mainly 14/15, but four who were aged 12, listed as working on various farms as "farm labourers".

Thomas Greep

Born in Widecombe in the Moor 16th December 1699.

Father Thomas Greep. Birth date: unknown. Mother: Grace Wickett Married 1691.

3 siblings:

• Mary: born WITM 21.08.1692

• Ann: born WITM 19.11.1693

• William: born WITM 9.12.1702

RESISTANCE TO APPRENTICESHIPS

Robert Dymond's book 'Things New and Old Concerning Widecombe-in-the-Moor' from 1876, includes a chapter on the old documents in the parish chest.

This includes some interesting snippets from the Overseers' Accounts including the following:

Amongst payments for 1714 was one of a shilling "for warrants to summons forth several p'sons before ye justices to show cause why they would not take apprentices".

This shows that there was resistance in some quarters to the taking of apprentices. Certainly it was a long-term commitment.

You can read more of Robert Dymond's rummage through the parish chest here

SEXTONS IN WIDECOMBE

A reader has provided the information that when she came to Widecombe in 1959 there was a Sexton there at the time called Oliver Townsend.

Oliver went around wearing a long black coat and lived in the Sexton's Cottage, now the National Trust shop (the NT shop has since closed and at the time of writing - June 2023 - is awaiting a new tenant).

Another reader remembers Oliver as someone very Victorian in appearance and attitude. He had a 'handlebar' moustache and was intolerant of the noise made at the fortnightly dance held in the Church House while he was living in the end cottage.

I think there is a photo of Oliver around somewhere, but at the moment it cannot be located. When we find it we will post it here.

SOME ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ABOUT THE LEAMAN FAMILY PROVIDED BY JILL HAMMERSLEY

The Leaman Family (page 110)

I fully appreciate your comments concerning constraints you made on the amount of content. I would still like to suggest the inclusion of the SWHT Information Leaflet - Poor Relief to be included in the Internet References area. This leaflet I have found to be extremely helpful in explaining, in particular, The Settlement Act section laying down the qualifications for gaining settlement. Maybe these could be included in the text. (I noticed you did reference SWHT on page xii for general purposes).(Author's note: the SWHT leaflet, available online, has been added to the References listed on the Overall Resources Index Page).

John and George Leaman

Considering the amount of references concerning the Leamans to be found in the Poor Records it has taken a while to fathom out what exactly had been going on. I found your text on p. 113 a little muddled concerning George and John's cases. Impossible to explain fully – a chapter in itself! Regardless of this I thought you may be interested in what happened to them in the end. John and Gertrude had six children, none were bound over. They lived at Dipley from 1816 until John died in 1843, buried in Widecombe. Gertrude remained until 1849 but finally got removed permanently to Tavistock Work House in 1849 where she worked as a weaver. She died in 1865 whilst living in one of the Tavistock Union almshouses. As yet I have no records of them spending any of their time in Lydford Parish. George lived at Dipley from his birth in 1816 until 1870. He married in 1839 and had 7 children, none were bound over. I have not found any records that suggest he spent any time in Lydford Parish. Sadly, I have not been able to find what happened to either of them after 1870 but have accounted for most of the children. Still researching this issue.

Lydford being John's and therefore George's legal place of settlement??????

This still puzzles me. John's parents lived in Manaton and also spent time managing the Newhouse Inn. This may explain why all the children were baptised in Widecombe Parish Church. Clement, John's father was also buried there. When John returned to his father around 1804 he had a hiring agreement for 4 years with his father training and working as a thatcher, He paid into the Poor Relief funds. George was born in Widecombe, had a hiring agreement of more than a year, worked in Widecombe and got married in Widecombe plus paid Poor Relief rates. My only thoughts are that during John's apprenticeship at Prince Hall Estate it was moved into Lydford Parish although your chapter on the subject of this happening states this occurred from 1818. His service ended in 1800.
(Author's note: This provides a possible explanation that has just occurred to me: Prince Hall was always in Lydford parish as was the Forest Quarter as a whole. It was just an ‘arrangement’ (albeit one that had existed for nearly 600 years - since Bishop Bronescombe’s Ordinacio) that the eastern forest quarter was counted as a part of Widecombe for certain purposes – because of the proximity of Widecombe church. So, especially after this arrangement ended c. 1818, Widecombe would have sought ways of returning those to Lydford whose place of legal settlement was Lydford and of course that would have applied to John if he was apprenticed there. His misfortune must have been that he applied to the Overseers for some form of poor relief at that time (probably because of his broken leg) and they took advantage of his past apprenticeship to try to get him removed).

William Leaman. Page 82.

William was one of John's brothers. He did an apprenticeship that ended in 1809. He became an agricultural labourer and returned to the Newhouse Inn with his wife and worked on land over the Foales Arrishes area close to the Inn. He aquired more newtakes and is recorded as being a Yeoman later in life.

Contribution from Tom Greeves

Joseph Leaman (Text page 61)

I think Joseph Leman of Dartmeet is reasonably to be identified with Joey Leaman who lived in a cottage in the late 19th century at what became Badgers' Holt - he was taunted by local boys and I recount the tale in my Dartmoor's Earliest Photographs - Landscape & Place 1860-1880 (Twelveheads 2015) p.19.

Ann Claxton's Report on Early Victorian Schools:

Some additional references/bibliography

Genuki Devon Devon - Poor Houses, Poor Law, etc.

SWHT Information Leaflet - Poor Relief. In particular, The Settlement Act section: SWHT Poor Relief Leaflet

Tom Greeves, Dartmoor's Earliest Photographs - Landscape & Place 1860-1880, Twelveheads 2015

Tom Greeves, Gentlemen & Rogues - A History of Brimpts Tin Mine, Dartmeet, Devon, DTRG 2017

Shakespeare, Liz, The Song of the Skylark, Letterbox Books, 2020 - Story of two apprentices in North Devon in the 1840s, based on researched events.

Susannah Wheeleker and Sarah Eyles, Two Studies of Poor Relief in Devon, The Devonshire Association, 1991.

Woods, Iris, Memoranda from the Parish Officers' Accounts Widecombe-in-the-Moor 1711-1840, in The Devon Historian Vol 14 (Spring 1977), the Journal of the Devon History Society, pp 17-20.

Woods, Iris, Parish Apprentices in Widecombe-in-the-Moor in the 18th and 19th centuries, in The Devon & Cornwall Notes & Queries Vol XXXV Part IV (Autumn 1983), pages 143 - 150.